Proving the Value of Higher Education by Marketing Outcomes

WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.040 --> 00:00:05.440 We are so good at branding our colleges, ed branding our presidents and all 2 00:00:05.480 --> 00:00:09.800 of that, but when it comes to really branding the profession itself and the 3 00:00:09.919 --> 00:00:13.960 role that it plays in an organization, I think that's something that we fall 4 00:00:14.039 --> 00:00:20.519 short in. You were listening to the Higher Ed Marketer, a podcast geared 5 00:00:20.519 --> 00:00:25.640 towards marketing professionals in higher education. This show will tackle all sorts of questions 6 00:00:25.640 --> 00:00:30.280 related to student recruitment, donor relations, marketing trends, new technologies and so 7 00:00:30.440 --> 00:00:34.640 much more. If you are looking for conversation centered around where the industry is 8 00:00:34.640 --> 00:00:42.359 going, this podcast is for you. Let's get into the show. Welcome 9 00:00:42.359 --> 00:00:45.799 to the high end marketer podcast. I'm Troye singer and, as always, 10 00:00:45.880 --> 00:00:51.200 I'm with my cohost and Soapbox Derby champion, Bart Taylor, where every week 11 00:00:51.200 --> 00:00:56.799 we attempt to glean what we can get from high functioning higher d marketers for 12 00:00:56.960 --> 00:01:00.159 the betterment of the entire community. This week we're going to talk to Terry 13 00:01:00.240 --> 00:01:07.799 Glittner. She is the Cmo of the Kentucky Community and Technical College System, 14 00:01:07.799 --> 00:01:11.599 and what we're going to talk to her about today is how to communicate and 15 00:01:11.799 --> 00:01:18.120 prove the value of highed education and marketing outcomes. Yeah, sure, I 16 00:01:18.120 --> 00:01:21.760 think it's as a great episode. I'm really excited to listen to this and 17 00:01:21.920 --> 00:01:25.040 you know I don't, I don't have a tremendous amount of experience and community 18 00:01:25.079 --> 00:01:27.480 colleges, so I always love talking to Terry or Jeff fanter. We've had 19 00:01:27.519 --> 00:01:30.920 on the on the episode before as well. But I think it's it's very 20 00:01:30.959 --> 00:01:34.079 interesting because even though sometimes we all look at it and say, well, 21 00:01:34.120 --> 00:01:38.239 there's publics, there's privates, there's community colleges and essence we're all doing the 22 00:01:38.280 --> 00:01:42.680 same type of work. We're all rowing in the same direction, and sometimes 23 00:01:42.680 --> 00:01:47.680 that is in communicating the value of higher education and doing that throughoutcomes, doing 24 00:01:47.680 --> 00:01:51.760 that through understanding affordability and communicating that. Well, I think Terry has some 25 00:01:51.799 --> 00:01:56.000 really good points and some really good articulation of how they're doing that in her 26 00:01:56.000 --> 00:01:59.319 system. That, I think would be very applicable to just about everybody. 27 00:01:59.400 --> 00:02:05.640 Let's jump into our conversation with Terry. It's my pleasure to welcome Terry Giltner 28 00:02:06.079 --> 00:02:08.639 to the highed marketer podcast. Terry, thank you so much for being a 29 00:02:08.639 --> 00:02:13.479 guest with us today. Thank you so much. I am really honored. 30 00:02:13.719 --> 00:02:17.280 Well, we are honored to have you and before we get into our topic 31 00:02:17.280 --> 00:02:23.000 of discussion, which is communicating and proving the value of Higher Education and marketing 32 00:02:23.000 --> 00:02:27.960 outcomes, would love for you, for our audience, to tell us a 33 00:02:28.000 --> 00:02:31.759 little bit about your marketing background and then also a little bit about the organization 34 00:02:32.319 --> 00:02:37.199 that. Sure, I started in marketing. I don't even want to tell 35 00:02:37.280 --> 00:02:42.039 how many years ago. This isn't my first Rodeo, as the commercial says, 36 00:02:42.080 --> 00:02:46.159 that many, many years ago. I grew up in marketing through working 37 00:02:46.240 --> 00:02:52.000 at Kentucky Fried Chicken and I did all things there. I was there about 38 00:02:52.080 --> 00:02:58.280 ten years and did field marketing, new product marketing, handled the national advertising 39 00:02:58.280 --> 00:03:02.479 for about two years. Wow, so did menu board. So all across 40 00:03:02.560 --> 00:03:08.520 the board. But then I left a KFC to go with a new product 41 00:03:08.560 --> 00:03:13.879 developer company that I ran into when I was working on new products with KFC, 42 00:03:14.599 --> 00:03:19.080 and it was a startup and we developed and help market new products for 43 00:03:19.199 --> 00:03:23.639 restaurant chains and I did that for about another nine years and then I had 44 00:03:23.680 --> 00:03:28.879 a life changing event and I kind of quit work for a little bit and 45 00:03:28.919 --> 00:03:30.800 called my mother up one day and said, listen, I'm just looking for 46 00:03:30.879 --> 00:03:37.280 something part time and she worked for the governor of Kentucky and a week later 47 00:03:37.319 --> 00:03:43.599 I was executive director of Communications for the Transportation Cabinet and that was way. 48 00:03:43.840 --> 00:03:47.199 That was a shock to get something so quickly like that, but also to 49 00:03:47.240 --> 00:03:51.759 step into state government, which those of you have been in that that is 50 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:58.520 an altar universe, not operate very much like the private sector. And I 51 00:03:58.520 --> 00:04:01.479 did that stated state government for a while, worked in transportation, which I 52 00:04:01.479 --> 00:04:05.319 actually loved it, and then must called over to the governor's office to be 53 00:04:05.400 --> 00:04:12.960 on his communication staff and executor, executor director of communications, and he was 54 00:04:13.000 --> 00:04:18.680 the governor that created the Community College System in Kentucky, and so he did 55 00:04:18.720 --> 00:04:24.879 a huge higher ed reform as part of his platform, which really did change 56 00:04:25.000 --> 00:04:30.800 the state. And after I left him and he went out of office, 57 00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:34.319 I was able to get this job as head of marketing, Chief Marketing Officer 58 00:04:34.360 --> 00:04:39.360 of the Kentucky Community and Technical College System. and to tell a little bit 59 00:04:39.360 --> 00:04:45.439 about us. What he did in highreed reform is he took the community colleges 60 00:04:45.480 --> 00:04:48.560 that were part of the University of Kentucky, he took those away from them 61 00:04:48.600 --> 00:04:54.279 and he took the technical colleges that were part of state government and combined them 62 00:04:54.959 --> 00:04:58.720 and this was a shotgun marriage in many ways, but he felt like that 63 00:04:58.839 --> 00:05:03.160 was really important to our state to increase access. Kentucky has has one of 64 00:05:03.199 --> 00:05:09.079 the lowest educational attainment rates and he really knew he had to jump start this 65 00:05:09.160 --> 00:05:14.639 by providing more access and streamlining because he didn't feel like the University of Kentucky 66 00:05:14.800 --> 00:05:18.680 really had the best interest of the community colleges of mind. They were focused 67 00:05:18.720 --> 00:05:24.639 on their research and their their big programs, but not community colleges. They 68 00:05:24.680 --> 00:05:28.199 were usually they were using them a lot for fundraising and all of that. 69 00:05:28.519 --> 00:05:31.720 We brought those two institutions together that had a similar mission and it was the 70 00:05:31.759 --> 00:05:34.879 success of Higher Ed form. Reform. He did a lot of other things 71 00:05:34.920 --> 00:05:42.920 as well, but it almost tripled the the enrollment of community colleges and it 72 00:05:43.160 --> 00:05:46.680 increased the number of credentials. Were up triple from what we started. So 73 00:05:46.759 --> 00:05:49.920 it was a huge success for our stay. And how many schools are within 74 00:05:50.000 --> 00:05:56.720 the system? So we have sixteen colleges with us, seventy campuses at this 75 00:05:56.759 --> 00:06:01.240 point and a yearly enrollment of about a hundred and eight thousand students. My 76 00:06:01.279 --> 00:06:08.759 goodness. So you are over a large marketing organization and would love to get 77 00:06:08.800 --> 00:06:15.800 into the topic comparing your current higher education role to the past. Would love 78 00:06:15.839 --> 00:06:20.920 to know your perspective of where you think higher edgy education is going or you 79 00:06:20.959 --> 00:06:25.399 know how it's progressed over the past few years. Are you talking about the 80 00:06:25.480 --> 00:06:30.439 role of marketing in higher it yes, I am a complete shift. You 81 00:06:30.480 --> 00:06:33.079 know, when I started here, and I've been here I'm in my seventeen 82 00:06:33.279 --> 00:06:38.680 year, I was not allowed to use the word marketing. It was a 83 00:06:38.720 --> 00:06:45.079 dirty word, it was associated with for profit and businesses and just not a 84 00:06:45.199 --> 00:06:47.519 term you could use. Also, when I was started, I would say 85 00:06:47.639 --> 00:06:53.000 that the focus, and at our colleges and at our system office was primary 86 00:06:53.079 --> 00:06:57.839 public relations. Almost everybody in the roles of the college has had were ex 87 00:06:57.959 --> 00:07:03.040 journalists, no background in marketing, and so that really was the focus. 88 00:07:03.079 --> 00:07:08.959 And I have seen since the seventeen years I've been here now that is totally 89 00:07:09.040 --> 00:07:15.439 switched, that we're really having much broader focus in terms of what a marketing 90 00:07:15.560 --> 00:07:20.920 is and it encompasses all of the commodeds from PR still being one, to 91 00:07:21.319 --> 00:07:27.439 advertising, recruitment, advocacy all the way through. So a complete shift. 92 00:07:27.560 --> 00:07:30.800 Yeah, isn't it interesting that that it's changed so much. I mean I 93 00:07:30.800 --> 00:07:35.000 think part of it is the nature of the nature of higher education. I 94 00:07:35.040 --> 00:07:40.040 think that it's kind of grown up a little bit. You know, as 95 00:07:40.120 --> 00:07:44.000 you Terry, I've been in higher ED marketing for for a number of years, 96 00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:46.160 even though I came out of the private sector as well. Really decided 97 00:07:46.199 --> 00:07:48.639 when I when I started my firm, that I wanted to focus on higher 98 00:07:48.720 --> 00:07:53.920 ed and I think that you're right. I remember some of the initial conversations, 99 00:07:53.920 --> 00:07:57.959 even when we were developing websites for some college and universities in the late 100 00:07:58.360 --> 00:08:01.199 S. it's like, well, is this really something that is going to 101 00:08:01.240 --> 00:08:03.040 help us, you know, you know, get more students, or is 102 00:08:03.040 --> 00:08:05.519 it going to help us raise money? And then you look now and it 103 00:08:05.800 --> 00:08:09.879 seems like a silly question, but back then, I mean there was there's 104 00:08:09.920 --> 00:08:13.800 a lot of you know, a lot of that struggle between really understanding academia 105 00:08:13.839 --> 00:08:18.800 and then, you know, the basics of business, of just knowing that, 106 00:08:18.839 --> 00:08:22.680 you know, students in the seats are going to pay the bills, 107 00:08:22.680 --> 00:08:24.920 that are going to pay the salaries. I mean there's there's just a there's 108 00:08:24.959 --> 00:08:30.639 just a basic business, you know, equation that needs to be done and 109 00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:31.879 I and I think it's taken higher at a little bit of time to kind 110 00:08:31.919 --> 00:08:35.279 of come around to that. I agree. I will say, if you 111 00:08:35.480 --> 00:08:41.240 look back to the old four peas right of a marketing, I do think 112 00:08:41.360 --> 00:08:45.679 high it is still particularly community colleges are still stuck in the promotional land. 113 00:08:45.720 --> 00:08:50.000 They're starting to see how marketing really does impact the other four peas in the 114 00:08:50.000 --> 00:08:52.799 business. You know, our goal has been to begin to link as to 115 00:08:52.960 --> 00:08:58.360 enrollment because really I think even when they were thinking more about marketing and branding, 116 00:08:58.480 --> 00:09:03.840 they ex banded that definition. They were really mostly thinking about, I 117 00:09:03.879 --> 00:09:09.039 had to use the word, making things look pretty and right and communicating that 118 00:09:09.080 --> 00:09:15.639 way, and they weren't really to really aren't directly linking the role marketing plays 119 00:09:15.639 --> 00:09:20.399 and accomplishing all of the organization's goals, including enrollment. Yeah, I remember 120 00:09:20.440 --> 00:09:24.480 a recent episode we had with Ethan Braden, who's The a chief marketing officer 121 00:09:24.480 --> 00:09:28.039 at Perdue University. He he uses the phrase that you know, many times 122 00:09:28.039 --> 00:09:31.000 marketing is is driven on campus, where you know it's make it pretty by 123 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:35.080 Monday and we need this by Thursday, versus being the drivers of the brand, 124 00:09:35.159 --> 00:09:39.879 drivers of the message, drivers of you know, what's important to the 125 00:09:39.960 --> 00:09:41.840 organization. So I think you've made a really good, good point about that. 126 00:09:43.080 --> 00:09:48.120 There's an overall discussion within higher read of the perceived declining value of higher 127 00:09:48.240 --> 00:09:54.559 education and we'll like to know to what degree are does that affect community colleges? 128 00:09:54.000 --> 00:09:56.480 Well, it impacts him a great deal. In fact, we just 129 00:09:56.559 --> 00:10:05.080 finished doing a prospective student research study we do on every five years and it 130 00:10:05.120 --> 00:10:11.120 is about three thousand interviews with both traditional students, that's junior and seniors in 131 00:10:11.200 --> 00:10:15.840 high school, and non traditional students, along with teachers, guidance counselors and 132 00:10:15.919 --> 00:10:18.960 parents, and we've been tracking the value of Higher Ed and this was the 133 00:10:20.039 --> 00:10:24.399 fourth study that we have done and we started these studies in two thousand and 134 00:10:24.440 --> 00:10:30.320 six and every year their perceived value of Higher Ed is declined and and this 135 00:10:30.399 --> 00:10:33.840 last time was the biggest decline we have seen. We're just getting the top 136 00:10:33.879 --> 00:10:39.080 lines in right now and what was particularly disturbing is the decline in the value 137 00:10:39.200 --> 00:10:45.440 among teachers and guidance counselors, who really are setting the stage for those juniors 138 00:10:45.440 --> 00:10:48.759 and seniors coming out, but really those folks that you know become adult learners 139 00:10:48.799 --> 00:10:54.399 as well. So it really I think is impacting enrollment all around it. 140 00:10:54.399 --> 00:11:00.519 It's certainly has impacted community college enrollment. Our rollment has been down for almost 141 00:11:00.679 --> 00:11:05.440 nine years and really declined during covid and is really not rebounded. So I 142 00:11:05.440 --> 00:11:09.440 think that whole value issue, along with the other factors were facing in our 143 00:11:09.519 --> 00:11:15.600 economy, it's just been devastating and it really is not just about cost. 144 00:11:15.759 --> 00:11:20.000 You know, cost is part of that value equation, but it's about, 145 00:11:20.000 --> 00:11:22.879 you know, is it get and get me a job? And I think 146 00:11:22.879 --> 00:11:28.600 that it particularly impacts the the students that enter our doors because I think they 147 00:11:28.639 --> 00:11:33.000 in particular are more interested in that particular still level that they're going to get 148 00:11:33.039 --> 00:11:37.399 that moves them onto a career pretty quickly. Yeah, I think that this 149 00:11:37.399 --> 00:11:41.759 reminds me a little bit of the conversation we have had with Jeff fanner from 150 00:11:41.759 --> 00:11:43.679 Ivy Tech here in Indiana, and I think you and jeff know each other. 151 00:11:45.039 --> 00:11:48.960 That was our introduction. Jeff made a comment on the podcast was just 152 00:11:48.000 --> 00:11:52.039 how how important it is and he was using the reference of community colleges, 153 00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:56.200 but I would I would argue that it would be all of higher education how 154 00:11:56.200 --> 00:12:01.120 important it is for for communicating and articulating outcomes and just as you kind of 155 00:12:01.159 --> 00:12:03.960 talked about a little bit, the ideas it's a it's linking all of this 156 00:12:03.080 --> 00:12:07.960 to jobs and careers. And what? What is that return on the investment? 157 00:12:07.960 --> 00:12:09.279 Because, I mean how many times, you know, we can talk 158 00:12:09.360 --> 00:12:13.480 about okay, well, if I have a choice of being able to, 159 00:12:13.559 --> 00:12:16.159 you know, get a generic brand soda or, you know, name brand 160 00:12:16.159 --> 00:12:20.600 pepsire coke, well, I might spend the extra for peps your coke because 161 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:22.720 the return on the investment of the enjoyment is worth it. And there's a 162 00:12:22.759 --> 00:12:26.679 lot of other, you know, things that are part of that brand that 163 00:12:26.720 --> 00:12:31.480 are kind of mixed into that. I think sometimes we have to start talking 164 00:12:31.559 --> 00:12:35.639 about that in terms of higher education and how we market higher education to make 165 00:12:35.639 --> 00:12:41.519 sure that it that those outcomes are demonstrating that return on the end on that 166 00:12:41.559 --> 00:12:45.279 investment and being able to kind of really prove that through all kinds of means. 167 00:12:45.320 --> 00:12:46.919 Would you agree with that? Oh, absolutely. In fact, we 168 00:12:48.000 --> 00:12:52.960 switched all of our marketing, creative and efforts to be more outcome about three 169 00:12:54.039 --> 00:12:58.440 or four years ago, where, instead of going on campus and interviewing current 170 00:12:58.519 --> 00:13:01.879 students and, you know, under a tree with books and all of that, 171 00:13:01.120 --> 00:13:07.480 we were really interviewing our alumni and what that career had done for them, 172 00:13:07.519 --> 00:13:11.279 not just from a career point of view but from a whole life point 173 00:13:11.279 --> 00:13:18.000 of view. Our brand statement is we are here to improve the quality of 174 00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:22.360 life, but really to make life better for Kentuckian's. That's what we're committed 175 00:13:22.440 --> 00:13:26.879 to. So we're trying to show how we're making our students, our former 176 00:13:26.919 --> 00:13:31.559 students, lives better and that is the feature in most of our creative and 177 00:13:31.679 --> 00:13:35.320 stories that we tell at this point. But absolutely, and we've also changed 178 00:13:35.360 --> 00:13:39.000 our web, particularly our program pages, which we know are the first pages 179 00:13:39.039 --> 00:13:43.679 that people visit, to be more career focus, where they can see what 180 00:13:43.759 --> 00:13:48.240 the average salary is with the careers are that are linked to those programs. 181 00:13:48.279 --> 00:13:52.639 All of that we've made a switch to to show outcomes and I'm sure that 182 00:13:52.679 --> 00:13:56.000 you kind of talked about a little bit of that social proof that sometimes the 183 00:13:56.000 --> 00:13:58.759 social proof has been the current students, but many times it needs to be 184 00:13:58.799 --> 00:14:03.639 those alumni who are experiencing those outcomes. But I'm guessing to I think in 185 00:14:03.679 --> 00:14:05.440 our pre interview we talked a little bit about some of the social proof is 186 00:14:05.440 --> 00:14:11.120 either of them is even the employers that are, you know, employing your 187 00:14:11.720 --> 00:14:15.799 graduates, and tell me about how how you're using that as well. We 188 00:14:15.840 --> 00:14:20.480 are really trying to get more and more of our employers engaged in our even 189 00:14:20.519 --> 00:14:24.759 our traditional marketing efforts, to say that, you know, they employed these 190 00:14:24.759 --> 00:14:30.240 employees and how successful they were in the careers. And I will say with 191 00:14:30.279 --> 00:14:35.000 most of those students stories that we're doing now, where we're talking to alumni, 192 00:14:35.039 --> 00:14:39.840 we interview their employer at the same time and we have been doing most 193 00:14:39.919 --> 00:14:43.840 of these interviews at their place of employment, along with some of the things 194 00:14:43.840 --> 00:14:48.200 in their personal life, and so that really has been, I think, 195 00:14:48.240 --> 00:14:50.799 great. I think it's really important when we show some of our photos that 196 00:14:50.840 --> 00:14:56.120 we show that student with some kind of background that shows the employer they're working 197 00:14:56.159 --> 00:15:00.120 in and the career, that they have some kind of context, that who 198 00:15:00.240 --> 00:15:01.960 kind of brings it all together. I think that's great. And then let's 199 00:15:01.960 --> 00:15:05.519 talk a little bit about affordability. I mean, you know, we talked 200 00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:09.879 a little bit about that return on investment and again, affordability, and I 201 00:15:09.919 --> 00:15:13.279 mean there's always context with everything, and so you know, I talked to 202 00:15:13.320 --> 00:15:16.960 some schools and it's like, you know, affordability means this, you know 203 00:15:18.039 --> 00:15:20.799 it's the cost per credit hour, things like that, but at the end 204 00:15:20.799 --> 00:15:24.559 of the day, I have found, and maybe you can kind of tell 205 00:15:24.600 --> 00:15:26.600 me from your perspective, I found that a lot of times, making sure 206 00:15:26.639 --> 00:15:31.240 that we talk about affordability in the in the language and in the ways that 207 00:15:31.399 --> 00:15:35.639 resonates the most with our perspective students and whether they're traditional, with parents or 208 00:15:35.679 --> 00:15:39.480 with, you know, significant others who are helping them make decisions. Really 209 00:15:39.519 --> 00:15:43.799 being able to communicate that affordability and that return on investment is so critical. 210 00:15:43.840 --> 00:15:46.480 Is that? Is that something that you've also faced? Yes, and if 211 00:15:46.519 --> 00:15:50.799 I wish I had the answer on how to effectively communicate affordability. You know, 212 00:15:50.879 --> 00:15:56.879 that is really community colleges. One of their primary value propositions, right, 213 00:15:56.000 --> 00:16:00.360 is that we are lower cost and the than the rest the other options 214 00:16:00.399 --> 00:16:03.000 that are out there. Do you know? There's a lot more, as 215 00:16:03.080 --> 00:16:07.840 you know, to cost than just the actual ticket price of the education and, 216 00:16:07.879 --> 00:16:12.759 particularly among non traditional students, all of those opportunity cost you know, 217 00:16:14.240 --> 00:16:17.559 the job that they have right now that maybe they can't go full time to 218 00:16:17.559 --> 00:16:21.240 go back to school, maybe it is child care. You know, for 219 00:16:21.399 --> 00:16:25.759 most a lot of our students in the rule area, just transportation getting to 220 00:16:25.960 --> 00:16:30.759 and from the campus. So there's just so much involved in that cost factor 221 00:16:30.919 --> 00:16:38.399 that we really do, I think, have not really effectively identified the best 222 00:16:38.399 --> 00:16:44.360 way to market that and we're having huge discussions. In fact, we're going 223 00:16:44.360 --> 00:16:48.480 to go into some focus groups after this big study to really dig into that. 224 00:16:48.519 --> 00:16:52.840 When we say, you know what her words can we use? How 225 00:16:52.879 --> 00:16:59.080 can we demonstrate to students affordability that resonates with them? And that is something 226 00:16:59.200 --> 00:17:03.519 we are we are really struggling with and trying to get to. To give 227 00:17:03.559 --> 00:17:07.720 an example, we were doing some oneonone interviews with perspective students. This was 228 00:17:07.759 --> 00:17:12.400 about three years ago, and we were asking about affordability and I and we 229 00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:15.960 were asking about, you know, their knowledge of, you know, the 230 00:17:17.039 --> 00:17:19.640 four year schools in our state and then community colleges, and they said Yeah, 231 00:17:19.880 --> 00:17:26.559 yeah, we realize that you all are cheaper, but you're still expensive. 232 00:17:26.640 --> 00:17:30.440 So you know, it's I don't know, it's a hard one to 233 00:17:30.480 --> 00:17:33.160 get to. Yeah, I think you're exactly right. I think that sometimes, 234 00:17:33.200 --> 00:17:36.960 you know, for different audiences, and we've talked to a lot of 235 00:17:36.960 --> 00:17:41.200 different marketers who are on the podcast, I think a lot of times there's 236 00:17:41.240 --> 00:17:45.880 different messages and different elements that are so critical for the for the particular audience 237 00:17:45.920 --> 00:17:48.480 that you're serving. Whether it's, in your case, you know, students 238 00:17:48.480 --> 00:17:52.079 perspective, students for community colleges, whether it's, you know, faith based 239 00:17:52.119 --> 00:17:56.559 schools, whether it's, you know, other other areas. Being able to 240 00:17:56.599 --> 00:18:00.319 communicate those distinctives, being able to communicate those those element it's whether it's affordability 241 00:18:00.440 --> 00:18:04.920 or different things like that in context and very distinguished from all of the other 242 00:18:06.000 --> 00:18:08.759 options, is really part of the part of the challenge. But you're right, 243 00:18:10.000 --> 00:18:12.400 it's such a it's a secret sauce that everybody needs to do, but 244 00:18:12.440 --> 00:18:15.079 it's a very, very difficult one to do. Yeah, it is, 245 00:18:15.079 --> 00:18:19.240 and I some of the research that we are looking at right now. We 246 00:18:19.279 --> 00:18:25.200 know it's a very different message with the Jin's ears kids coming out of high 247 00:18:25.240 --> 00:18:29.400 school than it is with adults. We know with this new group that coming 248 00:18:29.400 --> 00:18:33.680 out of covid which is a totally different mindset than we've seen with high school 249 00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:40.720 students before. They're mostly living in today, they're they're not thinking about the 250 00:18:40.720 --> 00:18:45.000 futures. So when we talked about the long term benefits of an education, 251 00:18:45.039 --> 00:18:48.000 so you know you're investing this much. This is how much you're going to 252 00:18:48.000 --> 00:18:51.000 get out of that. You know, that doesn't really resonate with them that 253 00:18:51.079 --> 00:18:56.000 much. And even we're finding even that young non traditional student, so you're 254 00:18:56.039 --> 00:19:00.480 talking somebody that's like two thousand and two thirty, they're going to resonate with 255 00:19:00.519 --> 00:19:06.119 them either. So you know, it's a it's really is a hard one 256 00:19:06.160 --> 00:19:08.359 to get at. Yeah, as we wind up this show, we always 257 00:19:08.400 --> 00:19:14.079 ask this of our guests. Terry, is there a either a tip or 258 00:19:14.200 --> 00:19:18.680 thought, a top of mind topic that you have that you can share that 259 00:19:18.880 --> 00:19:25.240 could be implemented right away from fellow CMOS or other marketers within higher education? 260 00:19:25.759 --> 00:19:29.880 Well, I thought a little bit about this. I think one of the 261 00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:37.359 things that is impacting the marketing profession and Higher Ed the difficulty of all of 262 00:19:37.440 --> 00:19:41.200 us who are in marketing to market our own profession. Does that make sense? 263 00:19:41.200 --> 00:19:47.440 We are so good at branding our colleges, ed branding our presidents and 264 00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:52.000 all of that, but when it comes to really branding the profession itself and 265 00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:55.960 the role that it plays in an organization, I think that's something that we 266 00:19:56.000 --> 00:20:00.480 fall short in and it and it is pretty difficult because we're still kind of 267 00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:04.720 a fledgling discipline within the highered world. I think one of the first things 268 00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:10.079 that any marketer can do, and this is at any level, and I'm 269 00:20:10.079 --> 00:20:14.000 sure some of the very sophisticated four years like for du I've already done this, 270 00:20:14.359 --> 00:20:21.240 is to develop a common definition of what marketing is your institution and what 271 00:20:21.319 --> 00:20:25.200 it does. Oh, it back up a couple years ago we started tackling 272 00:20:25.240 --> 00:20:27.960 this because, you know, you walk in and talk to any of our 273 00:20:29.000 --> 00:20:33.799 presidents, every single one of them had a totally different, well not totally 274 00:20:33.799 --> 00:20:37.799 different, but a different view our definition of what marketing is and what it 275 00:20:37.039 --> 00:20:41.279 the role that it plays in the organization. So we have worked really hard, 276 00:20:41.319 --> 00:20:45.039 and this is something it takes a little time, but not that much 277 00:20:45.079 --> 00:20:49.079 time, but we were collective, collectively with all of our marketing folks at 278 00:20:49.079 --> 00:20:52.839 the college, to come up with that common definition, and it's pretty detailed 279 00:20:53.079 --> 00:20:57.839 because it also goes into here's our overarching role, but here's the way that 280 00:20:57.880 --> 00:21:03.880 we go about doing it, and it has really impacted and our organization kind 281 00:21:03.880 --> 00:21:08.400 of taken the blinders off. I hate to use that word, maybe the 282 00:21:08.480 --> 00:21:14.119 lens that that's a better word. We colored lends that some of our faculty 283 00:21:14.319 --> 00:21:21.039 and leadership had about marketing and allowed them to broaden and understand and it's made 284 00:21:21.039 --> 00:21:23.200 a big difference from us. It's allowed us to kind of move into the 285 00:21:23.240 --> 00:21:30.000 recruitment and enrollment we now I've taken over responsibility for leads, lead generation. 286 00:21:30.039 --> 00:21:33.920 That's a big leap for us, particularly at community colleges, but I think 287 00:21:33.079 --> 00:21:38.279 just make it getting everybody on on board and on the same page of what 288 00:21:38.359 --> 00:21:45.000 marketing really is and what it does for an organization. Thank you very much 289 00:21:45.039 --> 00:21:49.160 and I one hundred percent agree. If someone would like to reach out to 290 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:52.160 you, Terry, what would be the best way for them to reach you 291 00:21:52.279 --> 00:22:00.559 be the best way is through my email. It's Terry Dot Giltner at casetcs 292 00:22:00.720 --> 00:22:03.720 Dot Edu. I'm sure you all will show that, but that's the best 293 00:22:03.720 --> 00:22:07.519 way to get me. I respond to email really, really easily quickly. 294 00:22:07.680 --> 00:22:11.640 Wonderful will. Thank you very much for being our guest today. Bart do 295 00:22:11.680 --> 00:22:14.279 you have any thoughts that you would like to end us with? Yeah, 296 00:22:14.319 --> 00:22:17.519 I think that a themes kind of emerged, at least for me, as 297 00:22:17.559 --> 00:22:19.880 I listen to a lot of what Terry talked about and kind of kind of 298 00:22:21.119 --> 00:22:23.440 circles around value. You know, not only did we talk early at the 299 00:22:23.480 --> 00:22:29.880 top about just kind of the idea of what what marketing brings to higher education, 300 00:22:30.079 --> 00:22:33.720 the value that it does, especially historically being more in the private area, 301 00:22:33.960 --> 00:22:37.880 but then, you know, in the last fifteen twenty years higher atis 302 00:22:37.960 --> 00:22:42.680 really started to embrace marketing and embrace those for peas and traditional marketing principles, 303 00:22:42.680 --> 00:22:47.079 and so there's a value that that is comes out of that. And I 304 00:22:47.079 --> 00:22:51.680 think that value starts to you know, when marketers do their job correctly, 305 00:22:52.279 --> 00:22:56.519 the value is you know, the school see that value in that. And 306 00:22:56.559 --> 00:23:02.000 then I think also just communicating value in what we do as higher ad marketers, 307 00:23:02.039 --> 00:23:06.000 in promoting the schools and and representing the schools through the brand, you 308 00:23:06.000 --> 00:23:08.920 know, outcomes, you know, affordability, other things of really trying to 309 00:23:08.960 --> 00:23:15.000 communicate that value that we bring to an individual's life. I mean, Troy, 310 00:23:15.039 --> 00:23:18.079 you and I are both first in students and we've talked about this before. 311 00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:21.319 It's like, you know, the the trajectory that our lives went on 312 00:23:21.400 --> 00:23:26.880 in a change by higher education, by you know, post secondary education. 313 00:23:26.960 --> 00:23:30.559 Those things make a difference and there's a true value in our lives because of 314 00:23:30.599 --> 00:23:33.759 that, and I think Terry's done a great job of communicating and articulating that 315 00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:37.759 and how that's how she's leading that with with her school system. And then 316 00:23:37.839 --> 00:23:40.799 finally, I think that that last thing that Terry said was so important is 317 00:23:40.839 --> 00:23:45.200 how do we also communicate the value of our own teams in the in in 318 00:23:45.319 --> 00:23:48.799 marketing, within the within the academia, within the you know, the at 319 00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:52.519 the level of the cabinet and and different places of leadership? I think it's 320 00:23:52.559 --> 00:23:56.720 important that we articulate it for ourselves so that we understand this is who we 321 00:23:56.759 --> 00:23:59.880 are and this is what we do. We're not just the people who make 322 00:24:00.000 --> 00:24:02.960 things look pretty, where the people are actually driving the brand and that are 323 00:24:03.079 --> 00:24:07.400 making decisions to really impact the success of the organization and being able to articulate 324 00:24:07.440 --> 00:24:11.119 that better. I think that's a that's a very wise word from you, 325 00:24:11.200 --> 00:24:15.200 Terry, so thank you so much. Thank you. That closes this episode 326 00:24:15.240 --> 00:24:18.720 of the High Ed Marketer Podcast, which is sponsored by Klo solutions and education 327 00:24:18.839 --> 00:24:25.720 marketing and branding agency and by Think, patented, a Marketing Execution Company specializing 328 00:24:25.799 --> 00:24:30.839 in personalized and customized outreach programs. On behalf of my cohost Bart Taylor, 329 00:24:30.880 --> 00:24:37.720 I'm troy singer. Thank you for joining us. You've been listening to the 330 00:24:37.759 --> 00:24:41.160 Higher Ed Marketer. To ensure that you never miss an episode, subscribe to 331 00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:45.920 the show in your favorite podcast player. If you're listening with apple PODCASTS, 332 00:24:45.920 --> 00:24:49.480 we'd love for you to leave a quick rating of the show. Simply tap 333 00:24:49.519 --> 00:24:53.240 the number of stars you think the podcast deserves. Until next time,